Sound and Color

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Tom Lange on September 8, 2010 at 6:45am

Hi Christopher,

I had spent a while wondering about this as well. When I first got involved in sound healing I was very excited about these tuning/color concepts... but then I ended up deciding I would work with the instruments I had along with the healing intention.

I would be interested in hearing what anyone else has to say about this. Even with only tuning forks there are so many different tuning systems that I know I haven't heard about all of them.

What do other people say?

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Jens Mügge on September 8, 2010 at 8:38am

I can't say something about it because I know too less sound and colors. I know a little bit about colors and chakras. So I am waiting if somebody else like to share or reply. Some gals and guys are "soundhealer" , maybe they know more about these concepts.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Christopher on September 8, 2010 at 2:01pm

This sound-color data are needed for my small sound research. Perception of colors in relation to sound frequencies and their pulsations may be analysed also in statistical terms of:

- synesthesia (seeing colors of audible sounds or seeing colors of letters associated with audible tones or seeing colors associated with numbers; depends on the right or wrong presentation of stimuli)

- associative learning (when you learn a system, and then you recognize it respectively).

But since some "technical"/"solid" systems became world-wide-popular (like the rainbow based one, with C=red and so on) - it would be an interesting idea to include them into consideration.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Jens Mügge on September 9, 2010 at 11:56am

have you seen this Colored Overtone Scale ? and this sound color table? Is that what you are asking / researching for? Or can is this video about the Chakra Tonality a help for your research?

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Christopher on September 9, 2010 at 3:08pm

"Colored Overtone Scale" is octave-based system (the musical C is octavised - x2 x2 x2... until it becomes a frequency that equals the color "green"; H.Cousto popularized it).

"Chakras" are associated according to "colors" (from what I see), that are associated with "musical notes".

My primary question is regarding the origins of rainbow-system, where "C" is "red", because the other ones (octave based or synesthesia and learning based) - I understand.

My secondary question is regarding other "technical"/"solid" systems, that associate colors with musical notes.

"Chakra Tonality" seems to bring some light on this, I have to go more in details.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Julian Gregory on September 9, 2010 at 11:20pm

I just saw some information on this in the book Vibrational Healing Through the Chakras:With Light, Color, Sound, Crystals, and Aromatherapy by Joy Gardner. She explains how the frequency of colors matches up to those of light/colors. This might get you in the right direction.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Skye Løfvander on September 10, 2010 at 9:59am

Colours and music.
This subject is intimately related to the so called 'law of octaves' which in my opinion in the name of 'holism' has been pulled sadly out of proportion and trivialized. To put things in what I find a more appropriate perspective I am afraid I shall need to make my entry rather lengthy, sorry!
- and thanks for the opportunity to offer my contribution!

Before I start: A note about number notation in the following: 10^n = 10 to the power of n .

First the observation which is valid and extremely important:
Within both the field of auditive and visual perception, the octave evidently plays the same substantial role: It leads us to the experience of coming back to an already known quality on a new level.

Doubling the frequency of a given tone (which means simultaneously halving its wavelength) leads us to the experience of the same tonal quality in a higher pitch. So the proportion 1:2 is the arithmetic representation of the principle of the octave. The octave is the first interval of the harmonic series and a universal frame for all music. The singing voice of men drops during sexual-creative transformations of puberty so that male and women singing together in apparently unison are really incarnating the octave interval.

So tone is braiding time and space after the formula f x Λ = c (where Λ is the wavelength and c is the constant of the velocity of sound in air – around 340 m/s depending on temperature, air density etc.)

This also applies to colour: The human eye is designed to receptiveness of a colour spectrum covering almost an octave 1:2. In colour theory they tend to use wavelengths for identification of the various qualities and the lowest frequency of the rainbow spectrum has a wavelength of around 700 nanometers. (7x10^-7 m - corresponding with frequency 4,3 x 10^14 Hz – in the visual field the constant c in the above mentioned formula is substituted with the velocity of light ~ 300.000 km/s) whereas the highest frequency violet has a wavelength of around 390 nm (3,9 x 10^-7 m corresponding with frequency ~ 7,7 x 10^14 Hz).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visible_spectrum

It is obvious to all that the arrangement of colours in a circle instead of a linear spectrum, reveals the fact that violet and red are neighbour colours and not so far apart that their placement at the extreme ends of a linear spectrum suggests. So we observe the same thing as in the tonal world:
If we double the frequency (half the wavelength) we return to a quality similar to the one we experienced at the starting point. If we set off at the quality 'red' we could therefore imagine that doubling its frequency would lead us to 'over-red'. What actually happens is that we move to the ultraviolet spectrum which is not perceptible to the human eye.

I found it very useful to illustrate the principle of the octave with the spiral, where the analogy is clear: by one winding you come back to the same point but on a new level/ pitch. See my photo and video folders and webpage www.overtonesang.dk

So far so good!
When new age cosmologists construct their 'holistic' approach on the basis of the 'the law of octaves' they simply find the corresponding colour to for instance the tone c, frequency 256 Hz, by doubling (256-512-1024-2048-.... until they end up in the colour spectrum after 41 doubles/ octaves: 5,63 x 10^14 Hz which happens to be the frequency of a yellowish green.

BUT!

They seem to forget a few intermediate results. As a matter of fact colour and tone are
- manifesting through two fundamentally different waveforms: transversal and longitudinal waves respectively.
- separated by this enormous gap of 41 octaves (please make the calculus of 2^41!). And as the tonal and visual octaves manifest in a realtion with our sensory system we need to to account that it has its 'windows' where a perspective principle rules. The hearing range covers a little more than 10 octaves and in the extreme ends of the range the proportion 1:2 is NOT equivalent of the experience of an octave – we need to make the intervals much bigger/smaller in the respective ends to conceive them as octaves.
- Finally from a structural perspective different by the very fact that the hearing range thus covers 10 octaves whereas our sensory system is only open to a little less than 1 octave of coloured light. The ordering of vibrational language needs to build on different systems in the two fields. In music the basis for building a tonal system is generation by fifths (proportion 2:3) but within the colour octave you cannot generate more than one consecutive interval of that size within the range.

So to put it shortly: No direct translation between the two fields!

The mess becomes even more complex when the analogies are stretched to cover planets, chakras etc. And not least woven in to a popular concept of a septenary division of all these areas.

- The roots of the special position the number seven has had in many cultures is the observation of the 7 celestial bodies (sun, moon and five planets) which can be seen by the naked eye and were associated to gods, angel spheres etc. This is obviously an 'old age' perspective, but its connotation forms the basis of most 'holistic' new age systems
- The colour spectrum by no means has a natural inherent 7-divided structure. The names of the traditional spectrum red-orange-yellow-green-blue-indigo-violet mainly refer to Newton. But ironically (being one of the fathers of modern scientific thought) Newton was very occupied with astrology and alchemy, so he found it natural for a spectrum to be divided in seven. BUT from a more keen and updated observation of the nature of colour it makes no sense to name indigo as primary (or even secondary) colour. The spectrum is primarily – if we should talk about divisions – naturally divided in three and subsequently in six. In 'Opticks' from 1704 Newton issued his concept of colour-tonal scale relationship but it is somewhat tragic that neither he nor the scientific giants like Gauss and Helmholz who reissued the idea seemed to make any reflection, that the colour spectrum is created by nature, whereas the tonal scale is a product of culture – created by man. And all the new age cosmologists do not seem to bother the least, neither!
- The investigation into how people with a synaesthetic sense tend to link tone and colour definitely does not support the assumption of a direct unambiguous translation between the fields of colour and tonal qualities.
- The concept of seven chakras corresponding with seven colours is a very modern and extremely widespread in holistic environment. But it was not seen anywhere in spiritual literature before Christopher Hill's book Nuclear Evolution from 1968! The concept of chakra has become entangled in a mindset which is ignorant about its own historical evolution. I wrote an article about that on my website (in danish, so you will need to use a translator tool, sorry! http://www.detspringendepunkt.net/Entre/Chakramusik ).
- The division of the octave into seven tonal steps holds a strong position for good reasons but most 'sound healers' do not understand the principle of division of the octave and how to create a tonal system. And it must be emphasized that the major scale is NOT generated by nature but by man - it is a cultural conditioning which has been prevailing in western culture for about 500 years, so if you make equal signs (=) between names of the scale and colours/chakras/planets etc. you need to reflect which culture based concept you are dealing with for it would not be correct to call it 'a universal structure'! There are hundreds of ways to divide the octave into a tonal system and hundreds of ways to create scales within an octave with the material you have generated. If we should talk about any natural division of the octave within the fields of sound/music it would obviously be the one which you find in the harmonic series:
first octave (1:2): Not divided. Second octave (2:4): Divided in two. Third octave (4:8): divided in four. Fifth octave (8:16): divided in eight. Etc.

You may find my analysis (again in danish, sorry!) about some of these themes here: http://www.detspringendepunkt.net/Entre/besyv

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Christopher on September 10, 2010 at 2:40pm

I have read the google translation of your article, and I find your writings very informative, thanks. I always wondered when the 7-chakra system (as a map of consciousnes work) was created, and what was the reason of it (since there are other chakra-like systems). Google did funny job, but I was able to "transcode" it :-D

No matter what kind of mathematics stands behind the systems, octave-based and rainbow-based I found interesting because of two things.

1) My experiments with remote perception (remote viewing, protocol based clairvoyance) showed, that people perceive "colors" of unknown but sounding objects (like instruments), and these colors often were associated with octave-based system. The discovery was accidental, and it was not expected; I began to look for something - after finding, that the reports contained a certain combination of data.

2) My experiments with general perception of colors of sound and music - showed, that often people perceive/associate "colors" of audible and dominant frequencies - according to rainbow-based system, even if they don't know/recognize notes. This discovery was also accidental and not expected. Despite the rainbow-based system seems to be more social issue (learned), it is interesting because it is so wide popular.

What I found interesting was - that sometimes C appeared to be green, and sometimes - red. So the question was - when C becomes red and when it is green?

I believe, that this can be related to brain structures responsible for different kind of recognition. A different situation is when you try to recognize "what kind of a sound is it" - and different when you try to recognize the logical structure of music that contains sound. Therefore color perception would be a brain/context related issue.

And that is one of my reasons, why I began to look for technical/solid and popular systems. Is there a "common situation" (not related to associative learning and not related to personalized synesthesia), when "C" becomes "blue"? Probably - yes. Are there other "natural systems", that create perceptual colors depending on the context - probably yes. Which one - I'm trying to figure out. Why? Because I'm just... curious.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Steven Williams on September 11, 2010 at 10:34am

Hi Christopher,

Jonathan Goldman, author of Healing Sounds, the power of harmonics, has spent some time working on this subject. Maybe you would like to check by his homepage or otherwise contact him.

Anything else I could say has already been said by others.

greetings
Steven

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Planetware on September 11, 2010 at 2:19pm

Hi Christopher,

the sound-color relations based on the "Cosmic Octave" shows interesting effects:

The frequency of the evolution of the earth around the sun (the Earth´s year) 32 octave higher has 136.10 Hz.
Indian sitar music or Om-singing frequently is in tune with this frequency. Maybe a possible explanation:
the sodium-potassium pump of the nerve cells is based on the same frequency; potassiom ions are pumped with 136 Hz, sodium with 204 Hz (136 : 204 = 2 : 3 = a Fifth).

Therapies with 136.10 Hz (in the tuning fork sono-puncture or with other instruments) have a relaxing sedativ effect.
42 octaves over 136.10 Hz we have a frequency seen as Blue-Green, which has a relaxing effect as well.
Isn´t it intriguing that in the color therapy "Blue-Green" has a connatural effect like 136.10 Hz in the sound therapy?

Another analogy show the the 24th octave of the rotation of the earth around its own axis 194.18 Hz and 42 octave higher the color "Red-Orange" = both have a vitalizing effect. By the way: one octave over Red-Orange we have the resonance maximum of the DNA (deoxyribonucleic acid), which is the carrier of genetic material.

I am not really a scientist, but I have a .... how to say: hunch, suspicion? ... that the octave relationship between sound and colors is more than a symbolic one, If the analogies of the comparable effects of tones and colors mentioned afore are significant enough, the sound-color relation based on octaves is more a physiolgic than a symbolic one.

Sorry about my English which is really awful and horrible (I am fighting with the dictionary ;-)

All the best
Fritz

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Christopher on September 11, 2010 at 3:42pm

Thanks Fritz. Your english is fine; it was me who always asked if my english is clear to others ;-)

You don't need to be a rigorous scientist - to be an effective and visionary researcher/explorer. As someone would say - "the measure of authenticity is the effectiveness". Usually a "scientific title" means, that you must identify with a group of people or ideas, who tell you what you can and what you can not (otherwise you are a charlatan or an isolated outsider), and thus - you are limited to perceive the world in a specific pre-ordered way. This way of "science" - changes, slowly - but changes; scientists begin to be more open-minded, and ordinary people begin to recognize science in everyday life.

I have some other idea, that explains and/or completes the relationship betwen sound/color systems, but first - I must write it down in my languuage in order to be able to translate it. But it is more a "metaphoric" one, that relates one system to hearing, and another one to seeing (which are "a half octave" shifted between each other") - in terms of "aspects of expression" usually associated to certain colors.

Speeking of sound and color, recently I found an interesting piece of software. It converts the wavelenghts of light into s-RGB color (and it provides some additional infos). It shows also how the visible light would appear when you mix certain wavelenghts.

link:
http://malat.biz/view/Projects/SpecEd

It's freeware, and I'm happy that there are people who create such things with passion and innocent curiosity.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Christopher on September 12, 2010 at 6:07pm

Using the mentioned above SpecEd software, I created a table for s-RGB desaturated ("natural looking") colors, one color per one wavelenght number (### nm). I compared it with the table of octavised musical notes (within standard system - the logarythmic one, with A@440Hz; but the same can be done to log shifted to 432Hz or typically pythagorean system), and following appears to be.

the "F" is the beginning and the end, IR and UV, untouchable, the spirit, "of no color". it is interesting because "C" is the "beginning" of musical scale, and there is this threshold B/C and E/F without the halftones. Yang octave and Yin octave.

according to this natural calculus - "F#" to "G#" is dark red. The "A" is intensively red.

A# is orange, an B seems to be between yellow and green.

"C" is green. "C" is the center of visual perception. If we abandon the "chakras", but still use their aspective expression to describe something, we could say, that the C/"root" (survival, physicality) - is within the center of visual system. Most people are centered on the physical survival, isn't it?

For example, the "green" center of auditory system is within "F" (for feeling), and somehow it corresponds to the inner silence or silent knowledge. By hearing and listening, we are centered on feeling.

Green "C" is also the center of the Earth Life System.

"C#" is green-blue, and "D" is blue. "D#" could be understood as indigo, and "E" is violet.

It is a little different from H.Cousto, but somehow - it speaks to me better.

• ▶ Reply

▶ Reply to Discussion

• ‹ Previous
• 1
• 2
• 3
• …
• 5
• Next ›
• Page